Ooh, Christine, this is so interesting! I always assumed I was a Five because I was so shy and preferred books to socializing--so different from my helper, extroverted girlfriends. I’ve since learned I am a one (hello OCD and the compulsion to make the right decision in every moment). In our thirties, so many of my social, bubbly girlfriends are radically withdrawing from all the social obligations and to me it feels like a bit of a shock, but for them I imagine it’s a relief.
I figured you were a 1! Also, that’s so interesting that many of your social, bubbly girlfriends are withdrawing. Hopefully it feels voluntary and like a welcome relief. The energy needed to be a 20-something who likes to (or just thinks she “should”) socialize!! 🫠😵
This is so interesting! When I’ve taken tests I’ve been labeled as a 5, and friends who are into enneagram pinned me as a 5, but what I read about 5’s seemed to describe a stereotype I approximated, not *me*--so I never got into enneagram. I just didn’t find it helpful or illuminating. Now I’m wondering if it’s the gendered expectations the descriptions of 5 are filtered through that made it unrelatable.
That is interesting! And I really agree that the stereotypes on the internet/books do NOT feel helpful!!! But I strongly resonate with core motivations, fears, desire, etc.
I'm so glad you wrote about this, Christine! First, I'm glad for you that you are using Enneagram to separate your true self from your socialized self as a "good Christian girl." That's huge! Maybe the obsession you feel is because Enneagram is a key part of the process of freeing yourself from who you are not and fully discovering who you really are! I'm also glad because Enneagram has largely been a mystery to me, and your thoughts and those of others in the comments are helping me. I understand the basic types, but my problem is I've tested all over the map!! About a dozen years ago, I took the test multiple times and kept getting an allegedly impossible result--three types all above 90% (4, 9, & 2). Recently I retested five times with five different tests and I got 9w1 twice and 5w4 three times. Your comment to Gina totally explains that--9s often mistype as many of the other types!!! I feel like 9 IS the closest fit, but I also resonate with several of the other types (as listed above). In fact, I would also say that I struggled with my identity from childhood to middle adulthood, maybe even still do to some extent, so that could be why I can't get a consistent score. Ultimately, for me it's not the label I settle on so much as the self-discovery process that means the most.
It would be a 9-ish thing to score high on so many types! My husband does the opposite but same effect - scores really low (somehow?) on all the types. And he's probably a 9. Enjoying our conversation on the Enneagram!!
Thank you for that explanation and everybody for all the insightful comments about their types. I’ve learned so much from this article and discussion. Your comment makes me wonder if I’m too opinionated (I watch waaay too much MSNBC—LOL!) and it shows up in high scores in multiple areas of interest. Also maybe Kevin has to hide somewhat, try to be neutral, so as not to offend church members??? Just a wild theory! I’m sorry for the male-oriented 5 description; I think it calls for a really good enneagram book written by a woman!!😉 I’m *really* enjoying the conversation too!!!
Omg there are so many 5s here! Me too! 🤣 I’m a 5w4 and you are absolutely right that the male 5 descriptions are a real turn off. I resonate with the desire to be capable, and the need for loooots of alone time. But I also resonate deeply with the creativity & melancholy of the 4. Also your idea of masking, and the difficulty with finding your true type is spot on imo!
I find the enneagram to be most helpful to me in relationships - even more than self understanding (though it’s good for that too). To know the types of my spouse and closest friends helps me to get beneath their skin better and to love and be loved by them better. 🩷🩷 I havent thought about the enneagram in months, but then listened to Suzanne stabile on glennons podcast recently and took another deep dive!
I think I’m a 5w4 too, but I’m betting you have a stronger 4 wing than I do! I could stand to use the enneagram more in relationships, but instead I get all caught up in figuring out the exact theory of it, which seems like a very 5 thing to do 🤣🤣 I love finding lots of my people! And female 5s too! Thanks for sharing your thoughts and validating mine 😁😊
That makes sense - the desire to understand goes deep too. Have you ever heard the songs that sleeping at last made for each of the types? They’re really beautiful.
yaassss! I listened to them all when they came out and now Chuck has me listening to them again 😂 I love the in-depth exploration with the spiritual understanding of the types! Also Ryan is such a good musician 😍
The idea that trauma can hide you from yourself and make “typing yourself “ difficult makes absolute sense to me; maybe your type doesn’t change but it becomes easier to figure it out? I knew I was a 9, though, the first time I listened to a podcast on the Enneagram. They went through all of them and I kept thinking “maybe that’s me” until they got to 9, describing both their ability to feel/understand all the other numbers and the way they react to things. Every Myers-Briggs test or spiritual gifts test or other personality test always made me feel unsure of anything. This time I felt like that scene in Charlie Brown Christmas where Lucy tells him he has pantaphobia, the fear of everything; I felt both like him yelling “That’s it!” and like Lucy rolling backwards from the power of his revelation. I don’t know that a test would have done the same thing for me, though, because I always second-guess myself.
Then I get uncertain because the enneagram internet tells me that 9s will often mistype as other kinds (eg 5 because they’re intellectual), but a 5 will rarely mistype as another type. Implying I’m just mistyping right now. But I resonate with many parts of the 9 socially/behaviorally, but I never as much resonated with the core motivation about inner peace and not wanting to be disturbed! So... take that, internet? (I think? 😂)
Anyway, I love the feeling of it clicking in when you read/hear the kind that you recognize as YOU!! Yay! Lol about Charlie Brown (my kid loves Peanuts!)
I’m a Five. And deeply relate to “mom who loves her children but gets easily overwhelmed by the stimulation and feels like she’s going crazy without being able to feed her intellect; is already isolated and feels different from other moms so it’s hard to relate and make friends”.
I only identified as a Five, so don’t have experience thinking I was a different enneagram number.
I definitely feel like it’s easier to be a male Five more than a female Five. And being a Five mother is just not really socially acceptable (the idea that I might need a lot of solitude and space from others including my children is not okay with a lot of people even if it helps me be a better parent).
Since learning about autism, I’ve wondered how neurodivergence affects my Fiveness. Or are many autistic people Fives?
My first time getting deep into the enneagram I was dating a male 5 who was extremely Five-ish and I couldn’t see myself as what he was, since he was practically the Five archetype. But I wonder if circumstances had been different, maybe I could have seen myself in it.
Yes a mom five is totally not in the acceptable mom stereotypes. High Five (lolol) for breaking the mold, right??
Yes the autistic/five overlap is strong!!! Really makes me think/rethink some of that.
My youngest (non-binary though assigned female at birth) is autistic and a 5. Recognized themselves as a 5 before recognizing they were non-binary or autistic, in fact.
I had an Enneagram phase in my 20s - though not as intense as yours - and found myself to be a 5 (welcome to the club!). It's probably true that men have more freedom to withdraw into their inner world. But I was struck by what you said about trauma responses - I was bullied at school in England simply because my dad was and Anglican vicar, and the library was my sanctuary.
Currently working on many thoughts about trauma responses and Enneagram types! Ugh kids are so hard on other kids, but libraries are indeed sanctuaries!
I have a complex but mostly loving relationship with the Enneagram too! For years, I was sure I was a 1w2, then, when I was in a more secure place, I realized I was a 4. (Both 3 and 5 could be my wings, and it really depends on the day for me, LOL.)
Interesting the different ways enneagram is framed aye, I reckon so much of these personality traits are trauma responses, but who are we apart from the way we respond (helpfully and unhelpfully) to the pain of being human? Maybe a very type 4 thought, I have a strong wing 5, I suppose I’ve contrasted that with the stereotypically 5 men I know but of course few women could demand the boundaries that they do so that must look different!
Yes when I read the descriptions I see trauma responses all over the place. But I'm also very curious about what the Enneagram teachers say, about having an innate predisposition towards certain wounding / developing certain masks / personalities (as opposed to the Self or Essence). Traditional Enneagram thought would say it's more innate, which I find interesting if not necessarily scientific...
We need a focus group to inquire about the Five female experience!!
Ooh, Christine, this is so interesting! I always assumed I was a Five because I was so shy and preferred books to socializing--so different from my helper, extroverted girlfriends. I’ve since learned I am a one (hello OCD and the compulsion to make the right decision in every moment). In our thirties, so many of my social, bubbly girlfriends are radically withdrawing from all the social obligations and to me it feels like a bit of a shock, but for them I imagine it’s a relief.
I figured you were a 1! Also, that’s so interesting that many of your social, bubbly girlfriends are withdrawing. Hopefully it feels voluntary and like a welcome relief. The energy needed to be a 20-something who likes to (or just thinks she “should”) socialize!! 🫠😵
This is so interesting! When I’ve taken tests I’ve been labeled as a 5, and friends who are into enneagram pinned me as a 5, but what I read about 5’s seemed to describe a stereotype I approximated, not *me*--so I never got into enneagram. I just didn’t find it helpful or illuminating. Now I’m wondering if it’s the gendered expectations the descriptions of 5 are filtered through that made it unrelatable.
That is interesting! And I really agree that the stereotypes on the internet/books do NOT feel helpful!!! But I strongly resonate with core motivations, fears, desire, etc.
I'm so glad you wrote about this, Christine! First, I'm glad for you that you are using Enneagram to separate your true self from your socialized self as a "good Christian girl." That's huge! Maybe the obsession you feel is because Enneagram is a key part of the process of freeing yourself from who you are not and fully discovering who you really are! I'm also glad because Enneagram has largely been a mystery to me, and your thoughts and those of others in the comments are helping me. I understand the basic types, but my problem is I've tested all over the map!! About a dozen years ago, I took the test multiple times and kept getting an allegedly impossible result--three types all above 90% (4, 9, & 2). Recently I retested five times with five different tests and I got 9w1 twice and 5w4 three times. Your comment to Gina totally explains that--9s often mistype as many of the other types!!! I feel like 9 IS the closest fit, but I also resonate with several of the other types (as listed above). In fact, I would also say that I struggled with my identity from childhood to middle adulthood, maybe even still do to some extent, so that could be why I can't get a consistent score. Ultimately, for me it's not the label I settle on so much as the self-discovery process that means the most.
It would be a 9-ish thing to score high on so many types! My husband does the opposite but same effect - scores really low (somehow?) on all the types. And he's probably a 9. Enjoying our conversation on the Enneagram!!
Thank you for that explanation and everybody for all the insightful comments about their types. I’ve learned so much from this article and discussion. Your comment makes me wonder if I’m too opinionated (I watch waaay too much MSNBC—LOL!) and it shows up in high scores in multiple areas of interest. Also maybe Kevin has to hide somewhat, try to be neutral, so as not to offend church members??? Just a wild theory! I’m sorry for the male-oriented 5 description; I think it calls for a really good enneagram book written by a woman!!😉 I’m *really* enjoying the conversation too!!!
Omg there are so many 5s here! Me too! 🤣 I’m a 5w4 and you are absolutely right that the male 5 descriptions are a real turn off. I resonate with the desire to be capable, and the need for loooots of alone time. But I also resonate deeply with the creativity & melancholy of the 4. Also your idea of masking, and the difficulty with finding your true type is spot on imo!
I find the enneagram to be most helpful to me in relationships - even more than self understanding (though it’s good for that too). To know the types of my spouse and closest friends helps me to get beneath their skin better and to love and be loved by them better. 🩷🩷 I havent thought about the enneagram in months, but then listened to Suzanne stabile on glennons podcast recently and took another deep dive!
I think I’m a 5w4 too, but I’m betting you have a stronger 4 wing than I do! I could stand to use the enneagram more in relationships, but instead I get all caught up in figuring out the exact theory of it, which seems like a very 5 thing to do 🤣🤣 I love finding lots of my people! And female 5s too! Thanks for sharing your thoughts and validating mine 😁😊
That makes sense - the desire to understand goes deep too. Have you ever heard the songs that sleeping at last made for each of the types? They’re really beautiful.
yaassss! I listened to them all when they came out and now Chuck has me listening to them again 😂 I love the in-depth exploration with the spiritual understanding of the types! Also Ryan is such a good musician 😍
The idea that trauma can hide you from yourself and make “typing yourself “ difficult makes absolute sense to me; maybe your type doesn’t change but it becomes easier to figure it out? I knew I was a 9, though, the first time I listened to a podcast on the Enneagram. They went through all of them and I kept thinking “maybe that’s me” until they got to 9, describing both their ability to feel/understand all the other numbers and the way they react to things. Every Myers-Briggs test or spiritual gifts test or other personality test always made me feel unsure of anything. This time I felt like that scene in Charlie Brown Christmas where Lucy tells him he has pantaphobia, the fear of everything; I felt both like him yelling “That’s it!” and like Lucy rolling backwards from the power of his revelation. I don’t know that a test would have done the same thing for me, though, because I always second-guess myself.
Then I get uncertain because the enneagram internet tells me that 9s will often mistype as other kinds (eg 5 because they’re intellectual), but a 5 will rarely mistype as another type. Implying I’m just mistyping right now. But I resonate with many parts of the 9 socially/behaviorally, but I never as much resonated with the core motivation about inner peace and not wanting to be disturbed! So... take that, internet? (I think? 😂)
Anyway, I love the feeling of it clicking in when you read/hear the kind that you recognize as YOU!! Yay! Lol about Charlie Brown (my kid loves Peanuts!)
Your comment is really relatable for me, Gina, and your response, Christine. Thank you!
I’m a Five. And deeply relate to “mom who loves her children but gets easily overwhelmed by the stimulation and feels like she’s going crazy without being able to feed her intellect; is already isolated and feels different from other moms so it’s hard to relate and make friends”.
I only identified as a Five, so don’t have experience thinking I was a different enneagram number.
I definitely feel like it’s easier to be a male Five more than a female Five. And being a Five mother is just not really socially acceptable (the idea that I might need a lot of solitude and space from others including my children is not okay with a lot of people even if it helps me be a better parent).
Since learning about autism, I’ve wondered how neurodivergence affects my Fiveness. Or are many autistic people Fives?
My first time getting deep into the enneagram I was dating a male 5 who was extremely Five-ish and I couldn’t see myself as what he was, since he was practically the Five archetype. But I wonder if circumstances had been different, maybe I could have seen myself in it.
Yes a mom five is totally not in the acceptable mom stereotypes. High Five (lolol) for breaking the mold, right??
Yes the autistic/five overlap is strong!!! Really makes me think/rethink some of that.
My youngest (non-binary though assigned female at birth) is autistic and a 5. Recognized themselves as a 5 before recognizing they were non-binary or autistic, in fact.
I had an Enneagram phase in my 20s - though not as intense as yours - and found myself to be a 5 (welcome to the club!). It's probably true that men have more freedom to withdraw into their inner world. But I was struck by what you said about trauma responses - I was bullied at school in England simply because my dad was and Anglican vicar, and the library was my sanctuary.
Currently working on many thoughts about trauma responses and Enneagram types! Ugh kids are so hard on other kids, but libraries are indeed sanctuaries!
I have a complex but mostly loving relationship with the Enneagram too! For years, I was sure I was a 1w2, then, when I was in a more secure place, I realized I was a 4. (Both 3 and 5 could be my wings, and it really depends on the day for me, LOL.)
You totally seem like a 4! And 4s go to 1 in stress, I think?? It’s really interesting how our personalities evolve as we age!
Yes, and the desire to to be good (1) and the desire to be unique (4) could both be present, but the 1 was more acceptable in the church context 💔
🖤🖤 I’m a 5w4
Interesting the different ways enneagram is framed aye, I reckon so much of these personality traits are trauma responses, but who are we apart from the way we respond (helpfully and unhelpfully) to the pain of being human? Maybe a very type 4 thought, I have a strong wing 5, I suppose I’ve contrasted that with the stereotypically 5 men I know but of course few women could demand the boundaries that they do so that must look different!
Yes when I read the descriptions I see trauma responses all over the place. But I'm also very curious about what the Enneagram teachers say, about having an innate predisposition towards certain wounding / developing certain masks / personalities (as opposed to the Self or Essence). Traditional Enneagram thought would say it's more innate, which I find interesting if not necessarily scientific...
We need a focus group to inquire about the Five female experience!!
Interview: Having not only embraced, but fully believed the Bible, Bible teachers, etc., how does one find a faith worth having.