Wow, you are basically describing my life and also what me going to church looks like. My husband isn't currently in a pastoral role but recently was, and yes, this is how I approached my role as well. Would love to hear (if you were ever willing) how you and your spouse talk about faith and marriage, the impact on you of his job. That's been an important ongoing conversation for us.
Camaraderie! For me and him, I’d already basically faith-deconverted the time we got married, which has made conversations and expectations much easier. Luckily he’s a pastor in a progressive denomination (Disciples of Christ) and I actually enjoy going to the national general assemblies. But we live in a rural, conservative area so his congregation isn’t quite so progressive. So…I don’t feel super constant comfortable there, even though I’m fine with *his* theology! The kicker is there’s another church in town that’s like the only actually progressive one that I do like going to that I consider “my” church. I know he wishes I came more to his church, but he’s very respectful of me making my own choices!
Would love to hear how you goes navigate(d) this, too!
It's really healing for me to read that a parent is thinking through these issues when their kids are really young. The pressure on PKs is so enormous, but it doesn't have to be that way. Thank you for doing this work!
Thanks, D.L.! That makes me happy. Hope it still counts if my weirdo little brain could not do the pastor’s wife/church act even if I wanted to 😂 But I deeply hope my kids feel a sense of their own autonomy through all this!!
Hehehe me too 😂 Sometimes I forget that I’m technically a pastor’s wife (I mean except when it’s Easter week and I’ve been doing solo bedtimes all week 🤣). Full-scale rebellion!
I'm not technically a PK, but I might as well have been. Hats my dad has worn during my lifetime (let me know if any of these are unfamiliar terms and I can explain): grad student in theology, youth minister, associate minister, deacon, elder, and, through all of it, super frequent song leader, occasional fill-in preacher, regular Bible class teacher (all ages at different times, but primarily adults), and teacher at an uber-Christian school (plus a lot of curriculum development and acting principal when needed).
The expectations were many and detailed. I was an overachieving people pleaser, so I usually did okay, but that's still not a good experience.
By some weird twist of fate, I'm now married to a rather progressive preacher at a ridiculously conservative congregation. He is my staunchest defender - I am not a church employee, and until I get a contract and a paycheck expectations for me should be no different than any other member - but I still find myself doing extra sometimes.
My daughter is 4 years old, and we are fiercely determined that she can have her own opinions, her own voice. But it's a constant battle to keep these other adults, who she loves, from "correcting" or straight up indoctrinating her.
And now that I've written a small novel in the comment section, good luck! It sounds like you're doing a good job balancing things and protecting your kids.
WOW! Yes I think all of your dad's hats (kinda unbelievable to hold all those roles, really -- I'd be exhausted!) definitely qualify you as a de facto PK ;) I imagine those expectations helped cement your personality as overachieiving people pleaser, too...
Whew! I empathize with you and your husband being at that church! I'm glad he's so supportive about what your role is (and *isn't*) but the overt or covert pressure is still a lot to manage sometimes. And for your daughter, there's so much, um... counter-education (??) that it seems you guys need to do when other adults have so many opinions about how she "should" be!
Good luck to you too! I'll be curious to know if things ever evolve for you all in a new or unexpected way!
Thanks! I like the idea of "counter-education." I'd like it better if it wasn't necessary, but I suppose there's always some needed.
I sense our family is on the precipice of some major changes, but I don't know when or how. Even these newer roles chafe horribly now for all of us. (But when we moved close to 6 years ago they felt ... almost freeing? Comparatively, at least. Yay, growth, I guess?) Changes are EXTRA difficult when your income depends primarily on the church, and you're never able to save anything up (since "you don't go into ministry for the money," aka, you can't possibly expect a living wage from us!).
Can you tell I'm just not feelin' the love tonight?!
That is fascinating to notice the changes you all have been through in the last 6 years -- and you clearly needed this stepping stone in the middle (it seems, at least!) because of how it was freeing at the time!
Oh gosh, I have so many thoughts / feelings about your income being dependent on the church. So much guilt about spending anything when we first moved here as a family -- like I felt soooo guilty having a [rare] evening out with my husband at the brewery and we only had his income at the time. The route I ended up taking isn't available to everyone -- being able to switch from his church's underpaying counseling center to start my own private practice that's thriving, and gives me / us financial independence from the church if we needed. But the sense of relief!! Cannot even tell you. Oy. It is SO complicated and riddled with tough feelings. Lol -- if you're not feeling the love, I'm right there with you -- and nothing personal against anybody. It's just a difficult system to be in!
(you're not the only one that can write a novel in a comment; don't worry! 🤣)
What a clear demonstration of how deep and traumatizing church indoctrination goes: Even the mention of your kids as PKs implies to all of us the very description you gave of how PKs are "expected" to be. What a gift it is to your kids that you are not laying that burden on them and they are free to be themselves.
Wow, you are basically describing my life and also what me going to church looks like. My husband isn't currently in a pastoral role but recently was, and yes, this is how I approached my role as well. Would love to hear (if you were ever willing) how you and your spouse talk about faith and marriage, the impact on you of his job. That's been an important ongoing conversation for us.
Camaraderie! For me and him, I’d already basically faith-deconverted the time we got married, which has made conversations and expectations much easier. Luckily he’s a pastor in a progressive denomination (Disciples of Christ) and I actually enjoy going to the national general assemblies. But we live in a rural, conservative area so his congregation isn’t quite so progressive. So…I don’t feel super constant comfortable there, even though I’m fine with *his* theology! The kicker is there’s another church in town that’s like the only actually progressive one that I do like going to that I consider “my” church. I know he wishes I came more to his church, but he’s very respectful of me making my own choices!
Would love to hear how you goes navigate(d) this, too!
It's really healing for me to read that a parent is thinking through these issues when their kids are really young. The pressure on PKs is so enormous, but it doesn't have to be that way. Thank you for doing this work!
Thanks, D.L.! That makes me happy. Hope it still counts if my weirdo little brain could not do the pastor’s wife/church act even if I wanted to 😂 But I deeply hope my kids feel a sense of their own autonomy through all this!!
This is so marvelous! You give me hope for the future!
I loooooove that you're married to a pastor and rebelling against the traditional views of a pastor's wife.
Hehehe me too 😂 Sometimes I forget that I’m technically a pastor’s wife (I mean except when it’s Easter week and I’ve been doing solo bedtimes all week 🤣). Full-scale rebellion!
What a difficult thing to navigate!
I'm not technically a PK, but I might as well have been. Hats my dad has worn during my lifetime (let me know if any of these are unfamiliar terms and I can explain): grad student in theology, youth minister, associate minister, deacon, elder, and, through all of it, super frequent song leader, occasional fill-in preacher, regular Bible class teacher (all ages at different times, but primarily adults), and teacher at an uber-Christian school (plus a lot of curriculum development and acting principal when needed).
The expectations were many and detailed. I was an overachieving people pleaser, so I usually did okay, but that's still not a good experience.
By some weird twist of fate, I'm now married to a rather progressive preacher at a ridiculously conservative congregation. He is my staunchest defender - I am not a church employee, and until I get a contract and a paycheck expectations for me should be no different than any other member - but I still find myself doing extra sometimes.
My daughter is 4 years old, and we are fiercely determined that she can have her own opinions, her own voice. But it's a constant battle to keep these other adults, who she loves, from "correcting" or straight up indoctrinating her.
And now that I've written a small novel in the comment section, good luck! It sounds like you're doing a good job balancing things and protecting your kids.
I am so here for your small novel!!
WOW! Yes I think all of your dad's hats (kinda unbelievable to hold all those roles, really -- I'd be exhausted!) definitely qualify you as a de facto PK ;) I imagine those expectations helped cement your personality as overachieiving people pleaser, too...
Whew! I empathize with you and your husband being at that church! I'm glad he's so supportive about what your role is (and *isn't*) but the overt or covert pressure is still a lot to manage sometimes. And for your daughter, there's so much, um... counter-education (??) that it seems you guys need to do when other adults have so many opinions about how she "should" be!
Good luck to you too! I'll be curious to know if things ever evolve for you all in a new or unexpected way!
Thanks! I like the idea of "counter-education." I'd like it better if it wasn't necessary, but I suppose there's always some needed.
I sense our family is on the precipice of some major changes, but I don't know when or how. Even these newer roles chafe horribly now for all of us. (But when we moved close to 6 years ago they felt ... almost freeing? Comparatively, at least. Yay, growth, I guess?) Changes are EXTRA difficult when your income depends primarily on the church, and you're never able to save anything up (since "you don't go into ministry for the money," aka, you can't possibly expect a living wage from us!).
Can you tell I'm just not feelin' the love tonight?!
That is fascinating to notice the changes you all have been through in the last 6 years -- and you clearly needed this stepping stone in the middle (it seems, at least!) because of how it was freeing at the time!
Oh gosh, I have so many thoughts / feelings about your income being dependent on the church. So much guilt about spending anything when we first moved here as a family -- like I felt soooo guilty having a [rare] evening out with my husband at the brewery and we only had his income at the time. The route I ended up taking isn't available to everyone -- being able to switch from his church's underpaying counseling center to start my own private practice that's thriving, and gives me / us financial independence from the church if we needed. But the sense of relief!! Cannot even tell you. Oy. It is SO complicated and riddled with tough feelings. Lol -- if you're not feeling the love, I'm right there with you -- and nothing personal against anybody. It's just a difficult system to be in!
(you're not the only one that can write a novel in a comment; don't worry! 🤣)
What a clear demonstration of how deep and traumatizing church indoctrination goes: Even the mention of your kids as PKs implies to all of us the very description you gave of how PKs are "expected" to be. What a gift it is to your kids that you are not laying that burden on them and they are free to be themselves.